This is a post, which I admit reveals rather more about myself than I would like. Nonetheless, I have something to say. More so because not a single site or article on the Internet says what I feel is the truth. Not even close. The time has come for someone to stand up and stick out his neck with the facts.
First, my formal position on the whole rape issue. I do not condone rape. It’s a violation of a person’s privacy. This article is merely an examination of mostly subconscious responses in more or less every man or woman I have spoken to and is academic in nature. So no flaming please!
Here goes…
Rape elicits extreme reactions from the public. Repulsion, anger, hatred, and most interestingly, moral outrage. It is this last emotion that I am most interested in and all that I disclose below is in relation to moral outrage alone. This won’t apply to men who don’t feel a degree of moral outrage. Let me start by examining myself.
When I hear about the rape of a young woman, there are two conflicting forces inside me. One is to view the woman as a person. The others is to view her as an object. The moment I view her as a sexual object, rape doesn’t become something I abhor. When I view her as a person, I pity the raped woman as if she was bitten by a rabid dog. Not her fault, but hey, shit happens. Moreover, in this case, the rapist is behaving like an animal with no self control. So I would treat it as if some animal had assaulted the woman.
Image Credit: Grahford
I think the sexual desire, when combined with the desire for power is what makes rape such a fantasy. Mind you, if it actually comes down to it, I know I won’t rape because when the victim looks frightened, or angry, she ceases to be an object, and becomes a person. In such a situation, I’m pretty sure I can’t commit a rape.
Nonetheless, the time has come for plain speaking. After holding detailed discussions with several men in confidence, and analyzing my own reactions to news about rapes happening, I can see that the first emotion that flares up in men, including me, is moral outrage. Now this may sound noble, but just wait until I reveal the sinister cause for this.
The truth is, it’s jealousy masquerading as moral outrage! This is specially true of Indian Society, which is still heavily sexually repressed. Sex is still taboo, and most Indian men just don’t get good quality sexual fulfillment. Men feel jealous of rapists, because they got sex outright without having to go through the tedious channels of courtship that most of us have to go through. They “Cut the line”! “Bastards!” they say. Yeah right. Let’s own up to the truth. We envy the guy who got a 20 something woman into his car and had his way with her for 3 hours.
Of course we can’t come out and say this. We want to kill the guy then and there, but we can’t do it in the name of jealousy. We have to disguise our hate in another way. I’ve learned always to be suspicious of moral outrage. Chances are, the real issue is something else.
Consider that men (I speak only for men here), feel moral outrage when a young pretty woman is raped. At the same time, they feel something like disgust, amusement, or confusion when an old sixty year old is raped. Why? If the outrage is actually about issues like violation of rights, and privacy etc, why the less outrage regarding rapes against old and ugly women?
Image Credit: dungodung
Consider also, that if the real issue is pain and violation of rights, then why do we not feel the same way for other violations. Suppose a woman had her arm cut off. That also is a violation of a woman’s rights to herself, and most of us would roundly condemn the criminal. And rightly so. But, no moral outrage. In fact, all the women to whom I have put the question, say they would rather be raped, than have their arm cut off.
But why do men go up in arms (no pun intended) against rape, when for the limb cutting crime, they would not do so? Why are there no “Hang the mutilator” rallies? Most women I have met, would again rather be raped than have their faces disfigured with acid or something horrible like that. For other crimes which violate one’s privacy like robbery, there is condemnation, and hate, but the quality of the feeling that is felt towards rapists is very different. Again I say, the crime of rape provokes moral outrage.
And I say that this is a cover up for feelings of envy and jealousy. Envy, maybe even for the fact that the rapist had the guts to do in reality, what some of us dare not do even in fantasy. And if the social class of the rapist is much lower than that of the victim, the outrage is even more. This is because the jealousy is greater, that the rapist “got” what he would never have got, had he gone through the proper channels. A young woman being helplessly ravaged by a bunch of slavering dirty scoundrels, is one of the most difficult things to digest, precisely because of the class difference that exists. The outrage is even greater here.
Anyway, the point is, fantasy is fantasy, and reality is reality. Real rape would entail too much of an emotional strain on me. To see the victims fear, and hate, and to hear her screams, would bring home the fact that she is a human being with rights. Since I value my own rights, I would not be capable of taking hers away. In addition to this, raping a woman would make ME too much of an object. I would lose my self control, and see myself as too much of an animal than my pride would allow.
Now I just have to sit back and wait to get lynched.
[poll id=”5″]
I am surprised at how obvious and simple the facts you relate are.. and I wonder why more people, including myself are unable to see this reality without someone having to spell it out.
Hmmm… makes sense… but I guess there's a part of me that is too shocked to accept that this is a 100% true. I am willing to agree that most (or all) men have subconscious impulses like this. But I would like to believe that it is not the major cause of the outrage that is felt against rape.
Call me a mindless optimist! ;)
Waiting to see responses from some men here!
Can I say one thing: Rape is not about sexual desire. It has and is and always will be about power. The power to exploit. The power to have sex with someone who doesn't want to. The power to be able to see fear in someone's eyes. The power to get what you want no matter what the other person feels.
Now, moving on to what you have said…about men feeling jealous and diguising it in the form of moral outrage…all I can say is: shame! I find it hard to fathom that there are men that are jealous that a rapist of all people has had sex. It has nothing to do with sex…it's about power. Why else do they rape an 11 year old or even an 11 month old? It worries me to think that there are men out there like you mentioned…so in addition to fearing rapists and perverts, do women in India need to worry about men in general?
In reply to Psych Babbler
Psych Babbler, to answer your statements and questions.
Perhaps you are not one of these woman, but something that may frighten you more than knowing that most men have compound emotions about rape, is that most woman, also have compound emotions about rape. Perhaps the word "rape," in the last sentence could be substituted withe the word "sex." Perhaps, that would make the sentence more agreeable?
May I remind you that "rape" can be a highly fickle term. One moment, a woman may consider something rape, and the next it is not, or visa verse. Also, under exactly the same circumstances, one woman may consider an action rape, and another, not.
May I also remind you that it is solely the woman who defines something as, "rape" or "not rape;" the man has no say.
I'm curious . . . do you think that a woman who believes that she is entirely not responsible for being raped, is more or less likely to be raped, than someone who believes she has some control in the matter?
Modern day psychology's answer, that all rapes be attributed to a simple "need for power," was designed specifically to comfort woman who would like believe as you might, that woman should be absolved of all responsibility in "rape." A simple answer is easier for our justice system to handle, and easier for our psychologists to make money "helping" clients.
People rape for different reasons, just as people kill for different reasons. Any sane person would agree that it is acceptable to kill someone in self defense. All rapes, like all deaths, should not be clumped into a panacean culprit. You would be hard pressed to convince modern psychology, that most people who kill, kill because they solely in need of power. Many fight, or kill for money, their woman, country, of for defense. You will have some people who kill for power, as I'm sure you will have some who rape for power, but even proving a majority, would be difficult.
I'm not convinced that the majority of rapes occur solely because of a lack of sex, nor am I convinced that the majority of rapes occur because of a need for power, but I'm fully sure that not all rapes are solely because of a need for power.
This is one of many flaws, of modern day, American Psychology.
Rape is like miscarriage, there are a lot of emotions involved, but when playing the blame game, a clean and straight finger can rarely be pointed accurately.
Here is a great essay on the topic by Professors Randy Thornhill and Craig Palmer: http://iranscope.ghandchi.com/Anthology/Women/rap…
In reply to Erik Stone
Erik,
Yes, that's exactly what I would have liked to state. People (especially in my knowledge, females) point out few exceptions where sexual attraction or more so provocation by the female would not have been responsible for rape to make a wide-sweeping judgment that sexuality is not in play. This I equate with people pointing out non-smokers who suffer from lung cancer to conclude that cigarette smoking has no role to play in the development of lung cancer. Just like lung cancer, driving forces for rape could be varied and would depend upon circumstances.
Bhagwad,
I must congratulate you for writing such an introspective post and also for its boldness. I cannot comment on the validity of your claim because I have not observed sufficient number of people nor have I asked them related questions. But from people's online behavior, I think there is one more factor there is so much moral or for that matter, any kind of outrage that is seen on such issues – faking it! I have seen there are some issues, where there is so much peer pressure to denounce it that people get overboard. You will not find people simply proclaiming that "this is a ghastly crime, it ought to be condemned", but there would be people coming up with suggestions of 'castration' and 'Bobbit-ing', etc. Such responses coming from females would be more understandable, because there would be some sense of insecurity that this might occur to them also. But still somehow I feel lot of words are wasted in trying to throw the best piece of literary prose to seem 'cool'. Perhaps, just like how you would stop when the potential victim would cry for help and would plead, you wold stop, I hope the very same people who talk of castration and Bobbit-ing would stop when the accused would do the same.
Perhaps, there is another kind of jealousy at play. If the victim would have been a beautiful person, and males would know/feel that her beauty had a role to play in her career-related success, then they might think in terms of "the bitch deserved it", meaning they wouldn't be sympathetic towards her. While, I do not know a rape victim in real life, I could see something analogous in in my final year exam, when a good looking girl who had in the many past occasions been given better marks than what others (& even I) thought she deserved simply for being good looking, had been flunked, most of the people (including girls) had ended up with this feeling of "bitch, she deserved it". I had caught myself thinking on the same lines. But it later turned out that she had cried before the examiner and used some of her contacts to have the result altered to emerge as the topper in that subject! ;)
So perhaps, one of the problems with our psychology is that when we start disliking a person, we tend to overlook that the pain they suffer might be disproportionate to what their mistakes (or undeserved advantages) were. E.g., the above girl, had indeed scored somewhat better than those more knowledgeable than her, but she was not so bad that she deserved to fail! Failure in the medical field is seen as a huge setback (most students would have been class toppers in their school days, etc., and plus also given the long career path involved), it would entail a minimum loss of 6 months. So most people overlooked this fact to start thinking that she 'deserved' to be flunked. It is this kind of jealousy that I am talking about (and thus is different from what you had indicated in your post).
In reply to Ketan
Hmm – very interesting. I didn't think about that kind of jealousy. It sort of makes sense doesn't it?
@Psych Babbler
In my opinion, the feeling of outrage in men is generated only for those rapes involving a stranger and a young woman. I know that most rapes take place when the attacker is known to the woman, but these are not the rapes I'm talking about.
I'm talking about the sensational rapes that make it into the papers. It is for these that the involuntary reaction of jealously takes place.
And of course, there's no need to fear anyone because of this. One can't blame another for unconscious thoughts. If that were so, we would all be in the dock, men and women. Even the most puritanical person would never consent to have their thoughts and dreams broadcast on TV. We would all be executed for the hidden meaning of our dreams.
So we can't judge a person by their thoughts – only their actions.
A very interesting perspective you have :)
You are almost fully correct in what you wrote. All that you miss, is that emotion is not black or white, and that emotion can be conditioned in to, or out of us. Outrage, pity, jealousy, and disgust can be felt at the same time, for any action. What describes our emotions is very complex, however, most would agree that it is our actions that define who we are, not our thoughts or our feelings. We can be conditioned to feel different emotions at almost any age, which can affect our actions. See the movie "A Clockwork Orange." What makes a man, in our society, "good" is that he doesn't take action on raping a woman, ie . . . that's you. To your benefit, you have not been conditioned out of thinking about rape, or conditioned out of your honesty (many are conditioned out of being honest). What you feel inside, is purely instinctual, unless someone conditioned you into thinking about rape, which is very unlikey, if you are American.
The real question, is whether the truth that you speak of, is of benefit, or detriment, to everyone as a whole? The fatal flaw which causes the ignorance of so many, on so many topics, is that most people do not consider themselves to be animals . . . and consequently, they don't consider others to be animals either. You cannot understand human nature or what it is to be human, without understanding and giving credence to human instinct, nor can you understand humanity without understanding that genetics and environment contribute 50%, and that instinct, can be from either (though commonly used only in reference to genetic instinct).
Is is this same flaw, which is the cause of the religion of "Global Warming." People think they are removed from nature, but in fact, we are nature, as other living things. Fix this arrogant misconception, and you shall find so many answers, that others, truly cannot understand.
Perhaps, some of us are "animals" and some of us are not . . . whom are the ones to be corrected?
In reply to Erik Stone
Eric, thanks for your thoughts! It's nice to hear a voice advocating the putting aside of moral judgment temporarily for the sake of the discussion :) .
Clockwork orange is one of those interesting movies where we're forced to decide if we merely want good behavior, or good thinking. In the case of Alex, his willingness to rape wasn't destroyed. Merely his ability to do so. But there's also a gap between thinking (or fantasizing about) something and the willingness to do it. How moral a person is depends on which stage it stops.
And while it's true we're part of nature, a large part of our angst arises from the fact that we are in fact separate from it at an intellectual level and there's no point denying it. Since man is more or less always battling nature (through medicines, roads, clothes and even brushing our teeth), it's hard to not think of nature as "the other" and while we may try and get close to it, we're never fully a part of it. Which is why man isn't at peace – and that's neither a good or bad thing. It's just the way we are.
Each individual is essentially alone no matter how hard we try and get close to others. And just as we can't fully merge with other people, we can never fully merge with nature either.
Just my thoughts on the subject..
In reply to bhagwad
Very profound, Bhagwad! Very impressed with your analysis of disconnect between 'nature' and 'what we want/ought to be' being the cause of suffering.
Now i know the male mentality and the truth behind why men sympathize with a rape victim (coz they are jelous of that they couldnt do it!) I thnx god for making me a lesbian.
Thx god i wont have to live with a man who feels like a rapist whenever he makes love to me.
Whoes main motive is to get sex out of me, even if he has to rape!
You said that men curse the rapist coz he got what he wanted, without the burden of courthship?
And to think many women enjoy these courtship things as romantic while all the time their 'lover' (?) is thinking "Oh what a fuck i have to do all these.If I could just rape her and get what i want then i wont have to play the romantic stupid actings"!
At least a woman really condemns a rape as a disgraceful thing and not becoz she couldnt do it herself.
Thats why i believe its better to be with a woman then a man coz you know what she feels coz the feelings and emotions are at least same and not fake.
You really never know whats inside a man unless you are not one.
And those women who appreciate rape fantacies i think arent woman at all. This is what happen when you live with a man-he makes you genderless, and you start thinking like him.
If she can have or appreciate a man's rape fantasy? You dont deserve to be calling yourself women then!
You cannot escape saying-"Oh boys will be boys" or ""men are like that, you cant do anything" of course i can do, and that is to stay away from as dirty thing as that for whom a rape is a fantasy or a thing to feel jelalous of . At least i wont be degrading myself by living with such a person who looks at me like an 'object' and not as a person.
Thnx for publishing the real thoughts you men have. At least you are not wearing the fake mask of a 'hero'.
"Men are never good.They are just big villians or small villians".
In reply to lezbereal
You must understand the way subconscious motivations work. Women have thoughts that are just as shameful as men which they wouldn't want brought out into the open. If I were to show you every little deep motivation of yours, you would cringe in shame.
There is no good or bad here. When dealing in psychology, you leave moral judgment behind. It's not a courtroom.
hey hey dont try to put your dirt on me okay.Its u people who are dirty.not us.I dont fantacise about rape or feel jelous of the rapist.For me rape is the most inhuman thing any person can do to other.So dont try to think that other people are also shitty and dirty like you.
I am not one of your women.And dont try to say that women also fantasies about rape.Haha what a joke! Its as stupid and vulgur and fake as to think that a man would fantacise about his dicks being cut off would he enjoy it!!!
.Dont bring women into your gutter.When you dont even know whats going in a woman's mind.She isnt dirty like you unless she is a whore made by you.
I really pity your girlfriend,wife,mother,sister if you have any.
When you come to Rape, Morality is the issue.And if its not issue then you are as bad as the rapist.
You cannot escape by saying that men are naturally like this or that.Men can control themselves if they want.But no. You always want to put the blame of your wrong doings on something. You are the one who are more favoured by nature then us, coz you can walk freely in night in street even with your upperu body naked without any tension of being raped.
But the women who suffers rape is like something you people can never understand.Why dont you go to a victim and ask her.All your theories would be useless to her.What she want is justice which is never given to her on time.
But you dont want it.All you want is fantacy, then why not label your site under Male Porn Rape Fantacies'.
You will get lots of moral support from your pals in here.If you want to lighten a major and heavy subject as rape then you should really start a pornographic site man.
But please stop using such a dirty thing as rape as a weapon to get cheap publicity (Like your pal Max Tucker)
Coz for a woman it can be worse then a nightmare.
I am talking about real women and not your porno stars.
AND I WOULD RATHER GIVE MY ARM, THEN GET RAPED
A woman's dignity is everything to her.more then her amr.more then anything.So stop putting your own thoughts by using fake female names.Man were you born out of two men? dont you have a mother?
Ask her what is a rape, she would tell you the right words for it.And believe me they wont be funny for your porn loving pals, they would be grave, and full of moral thinking and rechecking.
Rape is not funny, rape is not fantacy, rape is not excuseable, rape is painful, rape is degradation and complete devastation, more horrible then death for the victim.
In reply to lezbereal
You've ended up demonizing men, making sweeping generalizations and turning this into an "us" and "them" issue. Perhaps you need to see that you're not the spokesperson for all women here and neither am I the spokesperson for all men.
In reply to bhagwad
lezbereal, Let's be real? ;)
Bhagwad, I was going to respond to lezbereal above, good I didn't!
In reply to Ketan
There are many who think that people are what they seem on the outside and that unconscious thoughts, desires and fantasies are examples of a perverse mindset. My post isn't targeted towards such people :)
In reply to lezbereal
Look, it has been found by studies, that many people have fantasies that they enjoy in their minds but dont want to live those fantasies in real life, or in some cases peoplethat when they try to live their fantasies they find it digusting in real life.
It also have been found that many dark fantasies are just a methaphor of the subconcious that describes something of your life…. For example some women have fantasies where they imagine they are getting raped, the origin of this fantasy is that they want to have sex but they feel guilty because of their parents rules and judgements, so by having this fantasy their losing any tesponsability cause its its not a willing situation. More common in women withnhave a religion that forbids sex before marriage.
In the case of men having fantasies wherenthey rape someone, is very common in guys that feel powerless in the romantic and sexual areas, probably a shy guy with fear talking to women. Most of the time they dont want to rape, the rape fantasies are just a way of escapism, just as it is a first person shooting game, or anything that implies, lattacking, fighting and killing etc. is a metaphor of getting to feel powerful.
Me for example: since a long time ago i have rape fantasies and im a shynguy just as described in the las paragrpahs, no girlfriend, no sex, not even any capacity of talking to women. But i dont want to rape anyone in real life. Now I even have a lesbian friend and since im friends with her (she is my first female friend) my rape fantasies are less frequent, and my normal consensual se fantasies are more frequent… Why? Cause i feel alone, and im now more comfortable talking with women, and im more confident thatmi will one day get a girlfriend, and as iget to be closer to more women,the less rape fantasies i have.
So no need to pity my future girlfriend, cause right at that moment i will have no rape fantasy at all, only the desire to be happy making her happy. Oh, and have in account that even though im a man, i actuslly defend gender equality, i even wrote an essay defending women while attackng the stupid mysoginists that say that women are inferior and all those things…
So dont put all men in the same sack, when many of us are actuallyndisgusted by mysoginist men.
Oh, and one more thing i dont, fantasy on purpouse, it just happens. Im not raping a real person only a imaginary image of my mind. The only problem would be if i trieednto rape someone in real life…. With is not going to happen.