This is a post, which I admit reveals rather more about myself than I would like. Nonetheless, I have something to say. More so because not a single site or article on the Internet says what I feel is the truth. Not even close. The time has come for someone to stand up and stick out his neck with the facts.
First, my formal position on the whole rape issue. I do not condone rape. It’s a violation of a person’s privacy. This article is merely an examination of mostly subconscious responses in more or less every man or woman I have spoken to and is academic in nature. So no flaming please!
Here goes…
Rape elicits extreme reactions from the public. Repulsion, anger, hatred, and most interestingly, moral outrage. It is this last emotion that I am most interested in and all that I disclose below is in relation to moral outrage alone. This won’t apply to men who don’t feel a degree of moral outrage. Let me start by examining myself.
When I hear about the rape of a young woman, there are two conflicting forces inside me. One is to view the woman as a person. The others is to view her as an object. The moment I view her as a sexual object, rape doesn’t become something I abhor. When I view her as a person, I pity the raped woman as if she was bitten by a rabid dog. Not her fault, but hey, shit happens. Moreover, in this case, the rapist is behaving like an animal with no self control. So I would treat it as if some animal had assaulted the woman.
Image Credit: Grahford
I think the sexual desire, when combined with the desire for power is what makes rape such a fantasy. Mind you, if it actually comes down to it, I know I won’t rape because when the victim looks frightened, or angry, she ceases to be an object, and becomes a person. In such a situation, I’m pretty sure I can’t commit a rape.
Nonetheless, the time has come for plain speaking. After holding detailed discussions with several men in confidence, and analyzing my own reactions to news about rapes happening, I can see that the first emotion that flares up in men, including me, is moral outrage. Now this may sound noble, but just wait until I reveal the sinister cause for this.
The truth is, it’s jealousy masquerading as moral outrage! This is specially true of Indian Society, which is still heavily sexually repressed. Sex is still taboo, and most Indian men just don’t get good quality sexual fulfillment. Men feel jealous of rapists, because they got sex outright without having to go through the tedious channels of courtship that most of us have to go through. They “Cut the line”! “Bastards!” they say. Yeah right. Let’s own up to the truth. We envy the guy who got a 20 something woman into his car and had his way with her for 3 hours.
Of course we can’t come out and say this. We want to kill the guy then and there, but we can’t do it in the name of jealousy. We have to disguise our hate in another way. I’ve learned always to be suspicious of moral outrage. Chances are, the real issue is something else.
Consider that men (I speak only for men here), feel moral outrage when a young pretty woman is raped. At the same time, they feel something like disgust, amusement, or confusion when an old sixty year old is raped. Why? If the outrage is actually about issues like violation of rights, and privacy etc, why the less outrage regarding rapes against old and ugly women?
Image Credit: dungodung
Consider also, that if the real issue is pain and violation of rights, then why do we not feel the same way for other violations. Suppose a woman had her arm cut off. That also is a violation of a woman’s rights to herself, and most of us would roundly condemn the criminal. And rightly so. But, no moral outrage. In fact, all the women to whom I have put the question, say they would rather be raped, than have their arm cut off.
But why do men go up in arms (no pun intended) against rape, when for the limb cutting crime, they would not do so? Why are there no “Hang the mutilator” rallies? Most women I have met, would again rather be raped than have their faces disfigured with acid or something horrible like that. For other crimes which violate one’s privacy like robbery, there is condemnation, and hate, but the quality of the feeling that is felt towards rapists is very different. Again I say, the crime of rape provokes moral outrage.
And I say that this is a cover up for feelings of envy and jealousy. Envy, maybe even for the fact that the rapist had the guts to do in reality, what some of us dare not do even in fantasy. And if the social class of the rapist is much lower than that of the victim, the outrage is even more. This is because the jealousy is greater, that the rapist “got” what he would never have got, had he gone through the proper channels. A young woman being helplessly ravaged by a bunch of slavering dirty scoundrels, is one of the most difficult things to digest, precisely because of the class difference that exists. The outrage is even greater here.
Anyway, the point is, fantasy is fantasy, and reality is reality. Real rape would entail too much of an emotional strain on me. To see the victims fear, and hate, and to hear her screams, would bring home the fact that she is a human being with rights. Since I value my own rights, I would not be capable of taking hers away. In addition to this, raping a woman would make ME too much of an object. I would lose my self control, and see myself as too much of an animal than my pride would allow.
Now I just have to sit back and wait to get lynched.
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Thank you for your courage to say something authentic and new. I am not here to agree or disagree with the jealousy angle. I’m going to have to think about it and get some more feedback. But I did want to respond on the issue of the etiology of rape. I’ve had several clients (I’m a forensic social worker) who are rapists and have had the need to research, reflect upon, and discuss the etiology of rape with my clients, psychologists, and attorneys. This is a complex topic and I don’t mean to oversimplify, but I bristle at the smugness of the current “conventional wisdom” that rape is NOT about sex. Right. I personally believe this derives from feminist politics about sex, which men have embraced with open arms because they’d RATHER rape be about power than about sex. In fact, I’ll bet that BOTH men and women would prefer rape to be about power and anger than about sex because, in my opinion, we are too embarrassed to confront the SEX in rape. Let’s be logical. If power and anger were the primary motives in a assault, why not simply injure or kill the woman, child or man? There are many types of crimes whose motivation is anger and the expression of dominance and power. (Shooting helpless animals, abusing children, beating one’s domestic parter, setting fires, racist acts etc.) But rape has the additional and significantly unique component of sex. This means, specifically, that the rapist gets sexual pleasure from the sex act, usually through ejaculation, which comprises a dopamine reward system. If we politicize our interpretation of rape by removing sex from it, then we will never understand it nor will we ever be able to prevent it. I believe that rape is about sex AND power, but what is also vital is what is ABSENT from this mix—i.e. intimacy. It is well-known that when sex is experienced in a context of a nurturing, committed relationship, vasopresin is released in the brain. Vasopresin is the neurochemical that leads to emotional bonding in men. A man could experience sexual pleasure with a component of dominance within an intimate relationship which is not a rape. So it is really not power that is pathological, nor is it sex. Rape, by common sense, is the use of force to obtain sexual pleasure, despite its adverse impact upon the sex object (not partner), and perhaps even BECAUSE of its adverse impact. In either case . . . we can’t take the sex out of it.
In reply to atom
Oh yes I fully agree. Rape is more often than not about sex. And when a rape takes place after say for example a woman has turned down a man repeatedly I think it’s pretty clear that sex plays a huge role in the equation.
am sure u feel very jealous while u read in the newspapers about middle aged village women getting raped…..or 6 month old babies getting raped…….don’t know why I continually forget how pathetic and mindless the Indian male can be…..the fact that you seem to be educated and yet you try to justify jealousy and have people chiming in with approval and calling you bold shows how devastating the effects of male child preference in our country is.The typical Indian male is so self consumed and shielded that even his mother will defend him till death for committing rape
Rape has always been about power and always will be.If you are jealous of ugly filthy villagers and scoundrels getting away with rape then either you are too ugly to get laid or too poor to afford prostitutes.In India it is quite common to find a man with both the dilemmas.
I work for a non profit organization prior to which I was actively involved in covering the news of socially stigmatised victims in Pakistan and India.Heart breaking stories such as that of Mukhtaran Mai’s or poor dalit girl’s such as Bhagwanti , gang raped and left scarred for life,only leaves one to think how men perceive rape to be such a normal act,let alone an act of perverse pleasure which is in your case.
I still believe I haven’t lynched you enough.If you respect women at all don’t waste your time writing such pathetic articles again.
In reply to rocketqueen
Please re-read the second paragraph of this post. You can comment again when you’re ready to discuss things with an open mind.
In fact, I suspect you haven’t read my entire post at all. Otherwise you wouldn’t have displayed your ignorance of what I’ve said. I don’t need moral lectures from you telling me about the situation or rape and women in the Indian subcontinent.
This post is a frank psychological examination. It’s like a scientific experiment. The fact that you can’t appreciate that speaks volumes of your mental maturity.
I think I understand what you’re saying about the formation of jealousy and “cutting the line” but would you think it fair that I think this would be the opinion of males that never had a personalized opinion of rape?
For example, in England most teenagers at the moment like to tell rape jokes. Obviously if ever they tell one of these jokes to a rape victim they victim becomes understandably upset, however I have noticed that any male who knows a victim of rape well, will also become disgusted by the joke.
I don’t believe this is out of jealousy, I believe its because they know the pain and suffering a rape victim undertook not only in the physical act but emotionally for many years after. I showed this article to a few males who knew victims and although they understood how other males who only saw rape as something that happened on the news could feel this, they could not. They said they felt this due to the fact that the rapist got what they wanted but its not a reciprocal sexual act and the emotional effects on the woman can change her life completely. After seeing how a rape victim changes after an attack being jealous of the attacker is like being jealous of a mugger, they didn’t have to work for the money they stole but the person who was robbed is not only out of pocket, they may now be frightened to walk alone.
I think when someone has no “name to a face” and so see rape as an act that happens to someone else it is hard to comprehend the implications of rape and how extreme it can get. It can then seem like “just another crime” and then, like you said ” The moment I view her as a sexual object, rape doesn’t become something I abhor.”
Actually rape fantasy is common in both male and female sexuality. This however, is wildly different from actually committing a rape and does not in any way mean a woman would enjoy being raped. (sideline: this is generally why blaming the victim makes absolutely no sense as rape means the act was unwilling, if it were consensual it wouldn’t BE rape, it would be sex) so when you state “I’m pretty sure I can’t commit a rape.” I think you’re absolutely right. The article you have written, to me, shows the feelings of a a large proportion of perfectly normal human beings.
In reply to Apple
Thanks for that insightful commentary Apple. I realize of course that rape is terribly traumatic and my article in no way means to diminish the truth of that. It’s just that sometimes your reactions to something are contradictory and that’s what psychology is all about I guess.
It’s very clear to me that you don’t know anyone on a personal level who was the victim of rape. Rape is a very personal crime. It affects the victim, her family, her boyfriend/husband, and will have an impact on all of her future relationships and interactions with others. It will impact her day to day life, her sleeping and eating habits, her ability to cope with stress, with life, to succeed in work or school, to form new relationships, and her ability to trust in others. If someone were bit by a rabid animal, the animal would be found and put down for the safety and well being of the public. This is not the case for rapists, many of which go unreported and unprosecuted for their crimes. The “shit happens” mentality is part of what allows these events to continue happening.
You say that men who express “moral outrage” are in reality feeling jealousy. Clearly they have never experienced sexual assault or rape either personally or through a friend, family member, or lover. I do not think anyone who has ever been touched by the effects of rape would say that they are “jealous” of the rapist. As the other poster said, it is like being jealous of a mugger. It makes no sense.
I got the impression that you genuinely do not understand the effects or consequences of rape and its impact not only on the victims but upon society. You said that the women you talked to would much rather be raped than lose a limb. Many victims are in fact suicidal after rape. That is, they would rather kill themselves than go through the physical, social, and psychological trauma that occurs following rape.
In reply to Kathryn
true kathryn. i guess this guy bhagwat doesn’t understand the point that most of rapes happen under the threat of death and where a woman’s physical weakness is exploited. I come from armed forces background and i know for a fact that how does so called manly guys react when under the threat of a brutal death. most of them shit in their pants. I want to see this guy under the same situation going through a rape under a knife and then i would love to analyze his psychology and fantasies with him. he is just a sick bastard who is pretending to be an intellectual.
Just to give another possible explanation for the comparison of a young woman and an old lady. This may not necessarily due to jealousy. I think it is more because of perceived damage. We subconciously assume that there might more damage done to the young woman, because again we perceive that the young woman may have a higher value/status. Like for example, she has got more years to her life, more things to experience etc and now she will have to face trauma. Whereas, in the case of old lady we think that since she is already near the end of life, so less damage done. It is the same case when we hear the case of a young man dying and an old man dying, we feel more for the young man. And similarly, we also feel greater outrage when a baby is sexually assaulted compared to a young woman. This I dont think could be to jealousy, because I dont think we are more attracted to a baby than to a young lady. Same argument for the case of a higher class woman and lower class. Now, im not saying that it is justified to feel less outrage for the cases of older women, lower class women etc. Just stating my opinion that maybe that is how our judgement works subconciously…..
In reply to Kanakarajh Raman
Interesting viewpoint. It might be that as well. Though if a baby is raped, the quality of outrage is different. It’s a feeling of sickness, or disgust…not the peculiar quality of outrage that accompanies other rapes.
I would like to add few more things to “jealousy disguised as moral outrage” to the response of men to rape. It sounds true that we often feel pity about those cases in which a young women is raped rather than any rape case involving elderly women but the moral outrage response also springs up from a sense of insecurity and fear about the society and surrounding we live in. A sub-conscious fear that many of us may feel that same may happen with our sister,girlfriend, wife also is one of the factor for such outrage. we feel intimidated that we can’t leave our sisters,girlfriend ,wife alone . I think this is also one of the common reason behind our outrageous reaction to news of rape.
Bhagwat, i would really like you facing some goons with knives out …on your throat asking you to undress and do whatever they want to do with you. i want to see how would you react in this situation and where does this pseudo-male-mentality go over there. i have been in a situation where i faced some real aggression that could have left me dead although it was not of a sexual nature. i want to see how manly-jealous you feel when you go through a real raw act of aggression. i bet, that you would willingly put your pants down under such an attack and will ask for mercy. i really want to see you go through that buddy and then we can have a psychological analysis purely on a academic basis. Rape is an act of aggression which by accident have anything to do with genders or sex. with your kind of over-weight body type and subtle ironic smile, i really want to know how would you react under a knife. i bet, you going to piss in your pants.
In reply to jeet
My article wasn’t meant for people who react like you do.
In reply to bhagwad
No, bhagwad, this article was meant only for those who agree with you. It seems to me from reading the article and the subsequent comments that you only applude those who agree with you on some level. There is no possible way that you could know the internal workings of all men, let alone all individuals in general. I do believe that both power and sex play a role in rape but no matter how the woman is dressed or acts, if she does not verbally consent, it is rape. No questions asked. This act of blaming the victim (I am not referring to your article in particular more so your response to your comments) questioning her at every turn after she already has to relive and retell her trauma is the tragic reason why women don’t report acts of sexual violence. If a man is jelous of a rapist because he took what he wanted by force while they had to go through what they preceive as the painful act of courtship then they don’t deserve to have a woman. Women are not sexual objects ( I realize you pointed this out I am just reiterating), therefore it is difficult and almost contradictory to me for you to say men feel a sense of jelosuly towards the rapist if you previously stated that you do not see women as objects. However, if this were true, you would not be jelous of someone who treated them as such. I believe also that this article is demeaning men to the mental status of animals, unable to help their over zealous sex drive. Just something to think about psychologically.
In reply to Neveragain
You must understand the level on which I’m speaking. I’ve stated very clearly at the top of my post that these are not my conscious views. My article was meant for people who like to study psychology and who don’t pass moral judgments.
Read some more articles on my blog regarding women’s issues and women’s rights if you wish to know how I really feel. I won’t try and justify myself because I don’t have to.
A student of psychology would never pass judgment. He or she would try and understand how the human mind works. That’s it. This particular article is written on that level alone.
In reply to bhagwad
I am a student of psychology so please do not tell what I would and would not do. I do attempt to understand the human mind, however we are moral beings and that needs to be taken into account when attempting to understand human psychology. I highly doubt that most men think the way that you claim they do about rape, you don’t truly have any substantial evidence, as a true student of psychology would, only antidotal from, I’m assuming a small population of individuals. This means your statement is not academic, or psychological but biased opinion. So please don’t speak of what level audience this was made for because there is none.
In reply to Neveragain
This is like accusing a student who makes an analysis of what prompts humans to create weapons of mass destruction by analyzing the human psyche of wanting to destroy the world!
This is merely an academic exercise on my part- nothing more. You’re free to make any uninformed assumptions to the contrary.
In reply to bhagwad
Yes but that student would have an acutal population to sample from unlike you. There is nothing academic about your blog, it’s purely speculation. So you are obviously free as well to make uninformed assumptions since you so clearly do already.
In reply to Neveragain
You’re most welcome to poke holes in my dataset and propose alternative explanations in a non judgmental manner if you have no agenda.
But the fact that you come across as preachy, judgmental, and emotional reveals that you’re not ready for that kind of academic discussion. It would be better if you went moralizing somewhere else.
On second thoughts, even before i read your response, i was of view that i prolly over-reacted. I may have and i accept the point. But i didn’t mean to get it personal against you and that’s really not the point. Well, somehow i feel very strongly about this issue and NO its not because of jealousy. I am not jealous of any guy who physically over-powered an unwilling girl and has his way with her among cries and all that that ugly human expressions. I cant even believe, someone can be although i know few of the guys out there, really are. You know, the freedom to be what you want to be and do as you want to do is much more precious than we normally think and mostly we take it for granted, until something happens that takes that freedom away from you. When that happens, something changes inside you forever. You stop trusting life and this world. You lose a part of your self-belief and along with that you lose the singularity and purity of your aspirations and dreams. life cease to be 100%. You cease to be 100% yourself. Its much more complicated than your dry so called academic analysis. What angered me most was the callousness with which you explained that ordeal called rape and try to define it with some psychological mumbo-jumbo. forget about rape, let me give you another example of freedom stolen and someone else’s “Will” inforced upon you. Lets say, you got caught up in a police lock-up without any fault of yours. They are beating you to no end and asking you to accept a crime you never committed. The experience is downright humiliating and you feel utter helpless. You know, whats going to happen, you will follow exactly as they will ask you to do. You will do it because, you know you cant help it and you will try to save as much as you can of a piece of your future or your life. you will be a changed person after such an experience and that change wont be a positive change. trust me on that. Rape, by all means is an act of brutality. Its no different than anything other crime where someone does something for his or her own benefit with no regards to other’s well-being. Its criminal by all means and ends. Now, how does Guys react to a rape reported depends on their own sanity or the lack of it. How can you feel jealous of a goon beating some helpless weak guy on road? do you? how can you feel jealous of a man who has stolen something from someone? do you? if you do, then there is something wrong with you. How can you feel jealous with a man who scarred a girl for all her life by raping her? do you?
let me give you a rather personal account of reality and may be the reason i feel so violently about this issue. I am an armed forces officer. A decorated one on top of that. I mean, i carry the formal credentials of being a brave man, is at all there is some way to authenticate it.
I was 15 years old, 10th standard school going boy. there was a stretch of deserted and densely forested land of around 10 sq kms in my home-town. It was favorite hang-out of me and my friends. it was a place where we can be ourselves and steal an occasional smoke and other taboo things. This incident happened when i reached earlier and i was alone waiting for a friend to turn up. its was 7 pm or so and it was already dark. That place was also a favorite place for young couples who wanted to steal a moment of privacy. So there was on young couple at some distance from me. A group of 10 men or so barged in to those couples of privacy and i saw the guy with that girl running away after few mins. he just ran for his life. Then i saw those guys dragging the girl to some distance to a place hidden among few trees and bushes. i saw her trying to struggle and i saw her trying to cry out. i was shocked to react. After few mins i went near to the place where they took that girl. I saw her lying naked on bare ground like an animal and one guy raping her and others drinking around them, waiting for their turn. i can feel the expression on her face ..She felt my presence too. i kind of shouted something. The next moment those guys were standing in front of me wielding knives at me. one guy almost made a thrust at me, seriously trying to wound me. and then me, i ran for my life as well. i can hear the muted cries of that girl but 15 years old me was too scared to do anything. Although being a 3 party in that incident and all of them being a stranger to me, that incident never left my sub-conscious mind. it still lingers around deep in some hidden corner of my mind and it shouts at me time and again and it shouts “coward”. it also changed my perspective of life forever and fundamentally. once in a while, i still cry alone thinking about that incident. i cry for my cowardice. i cry for helplessness of that girl and of life in general. i cry in anger and angst. since then, i did many deeds which can classify me as a brave man. may be somewhere in someway it was a response to that incident. The point is – that experience changed me and it never left me. IT NEVER LEAVES YOU. its still there with me and i never gained my complete faith in this world and in people after that. Now think about that girl. what would happened to her Psychology? i cant even think about that, forget about rationalizing. Now, you made a point somewhere that why dont me make a moral issue when someone disembered a woman. why only rape to call for such an moral outrage. Well, we men only put women on pedestal in many ways. As mothers, sisters wives we want them to be holier than thou. we need this. Thats how a woman’s modesty becomes a precious thing for her and for the society at large. Now that’s a different thread of discussion but its society which makes a woman – woman. its more about conditioning.
I will ask you to read a book by a famous contemporary american write Alice Sebold. peter jackson of Lord of the rings – making movies of every book of her. Read a memoir by her, a true story. its called – Lucky. the book is famous for its searing and candid and honorable narration of being a rape victim. read it if you can handle it. its too honest and true that it almost physically hurt you. and yes, its also an excellent analysis of psychology of rape, which seems to amuse you.
I don’t emphatically agree with your position Bhagwad, but I can see your thought process. I would say there are grains of truth. Like a poor man who is jealous of a rich man, so a non-rapist is of a rapist perhaps on some level.
I would posit from experience that everyone deals differently with the emotions and thoughts that go into seeing, experiencing, or committing such an act. I do not agree as many would posit that such an act as rape is all power, or must be experienced to be understood. Each thing is a separate thing unto itself, and in each situation one must ask “What is its nature?”
For some viewing a rape, it would be disgust, others glee, and the rest a mingling of lurid trepidation, like watching an accident; they can’t help but hurt for that person, feel glad it’s not them, but also yearn to see and experience vicariously.
In the end I don’t believe it is all one thing. Some people rape for power, some for sex, some because the Easter bunny told them too. Whatever the reason, we cannot define it by one thing alone, be it jealousy, power, gender. It is an act, abhorrent as it may be to many, that has historical, pyscological, and sociological implications. If one cannot view it with its myriad of facets, like a piece of ‘Fools Gold’, then what is the point of morality, ethics, or society for that matter? The reasoned thought is paramount to the subject at hand.
-N.
There is this article by BY RANDY THORNHILL AND CRAIG T. PALMER about Why Men Rape. They say rape is a reproductive strategy exercised by defranchised males across all species who would otherwise not have access to females. Read it. Maybe the jealousy thing is couched into some bigger meaning